My most recent novel debuted today. I self-published, and after this, honestly empowering experience, I’m never ever going to query anybody again. I’m positively convinced the industry is cooked, and I’m happy doing my own thing, even if it doesn’t amount to much.
Thanks for this. I'd also love your take on what the reading experience of smut disguised as sex positivity does to the reader. I literally feel violated when I read graphic scenes- I cannot get why writers are producing stuff that nobody in their heart of hearts actually wants.
The mandatory sex positivity of even non-consensual sex is particularly striking when at the same time we face an army of sensitivity readers for whom nearly anything else seems to be "triggering"...
This sex-positivity-by-default position of mainstream publishing is something that troubles me, too. In my manuscript, my two main characters are Christians of variable adherence both raised in the Christian sexual ethic, which protects sex within marriage. Their Christianity is nowhere near the main point of the plot, but it’s an aspect of both characters I’m worried a literary agent or publisher will want to erase or change to be more “sex positive.” I believe that complicated feelings about sex due to a faith tradition are deeply common to the human experience, and should be dealt with the complexity and dignity they deserve.
You've identified such an important problem: Sex is not always good! Even when, as you say, it's fully consensual.
And no one seems to want to say this. Sex can provide some of our best experiences. It's also true, though, that many (most?) of the worst things human beings can do to each other are sexual.
When you don't need to care about your sexual partner--when you don't even have to know each other--you're giving that depravity free room to run.
Great thoughts! You contrasted restraint with empowerment, but I'd go so far as to argue that restraint and self discipline are ultimately sexually "empowering." Not being a slave to your impulses allows you to give yourself fully and freely to your spouse. This narrative is clearly the minority (and often mocked) in modern discussions on the topic.
regarding the shared exchange with your agent: I found myself agreeing with both you and him 50%. I see no need for characters to grow or learn anything, as long as the story is interesting and the writing is good. the presence of a moral message itself has no bearing, for me, on the impact of a novel. I must confess to not having read your book, but if Adam and Cassie go down to the 50Shades room and nothing happens, it may even be more seductive and intriguing than if you had elaborated a debaucherous encounter, provided how it is written is interesting. it sounds like your agent is more of a plot focussed chap.
This made me think. I’m very much in the sex-positive camp, but I also believe literature loses something when any human experience gets flattened into a single moral message. Intimacy in fiction should be able to be liberating, destructive, confusing, sacred, restrained, or even refused. Sometimes the most powerful moment in a story is not the act itself, but the choice not to cross a line.
Imagine not publishing or understanding A Farewell to Arms by Ernest Hemingway because the fully consensual sex in the novel serves to underscore the characters' trauma and desperation.
My latest romance novels address this, though that's not what I set out to do. I set out to write a romance about twenty-somethings in the nineties, when sex positivity was in it's earlier stages, but dating still happened. I wanted to honor the nineties, Gen X, and life in the early stages of the hook up culture. Yes, they have consensual sex, and yes it is sexy, but...there are consequences. Broken hearts. Unwanted pregnancy. Discovering the value of chastity by confronting the very notion of sexual empowerment. The second book is about the couple in the now, with young adult children navigating the same issues. Honest talk about sex. Honest talk about chastity. Honest talk about love. Not a Hallmark romance, and not a queer/sex positive book. A normal romance with all the longing, mistakes, and redemption one finds in real life. They were a joy to write, and yes, I have to self-publish because even my publisher, who loved my cougar romance book, is looking for more queer stuff right now. Besides, it takes two years for them to publish a book once they accept it, and methinks we need to move faster than that now.
How do you consider then that probably the single largest book (trilogy) sold in recent memory was about BDSM female sexual subordination, and it did not start through agents but was self-published then on-demand then bought? I’m speaking of course 50 Shades of Grey, and subsequent.
This is, by far, the best line. “Today, in an industry that has mistaken simplicity for sophistication and ideology for art, we need not only a callback to morality but to literary depth. Because only literature that approaches all facets of the human experience from a nuanced perspective will ever be able to tell the truth about what it means to be human.” I couldn’t agree more. Thanks for your thoughts!
My most recent novel debuted today. I self-published, and after this, honestly empowering experience, I’m never ever going to query anybody again. I’m positively convinced the industry is cooked, and I’m happy doing my own thing, even if it doesn’t amount to much.
Thanks for this. I'd also love your take on what the reading experience of smut disguised as sex positivity does to the reader. I literally feel violated when I read graphic scenes- I cannot get why writers are producing stuff that nobody in their heart of hearts actually wants.
Keep going! Rooting for you :)
That means a lot! Thank you
“but boy, do I have some theories.”
I so enjoy seeing sentences like this when you’re diagnosing. I know a +10 evisceration is just moments away.
The mandatory sex positivity of even non-consensual sex is particularly striking when at the same time we face an army of sensitivity readers for whom nearly anything else seems to be "triggering"...
This sex-positivity-by-default position of mainstream publishing is something that troubles me, too. In my manuscript, my two main characters are Christians of variable adherence both raised in the Christian sexual ethic, which protects sex within marriage. Their Christianity is nowhere near the main point of the plot, but it’s an aspect of both characters I’m worried a literary agent or publisher will want to erase or change to be more “sex positive.” I believe that complicated feelings about sex due to a faith tradition are deeply common to the human experience, and should be dealt with the complexity and dignity they deserve.
You've identified such an important problem: Sex is not always good! Even when, as you say, it's fully consensual.
And no one seems to want to say this. Sex can provide some of our best experiences. It's also true, though, that many (most?) of the worst things human beings can do to each other are sexual.
When you don't need to care about your sexual partner--when you don't even have to know each other--you're giving that depravity free room to run.
Keep fighting the good fight, Liza.
Great thoughts! You contrasted restraint with empowerment, but I'd go so far as to argue that restraint and self discipline are ultimately sexually "empowering." Not being a slave to your impulses allows you to give yourself fully and freely to your spouse. This narrative is clearly the minority (and often mocked) in modern discussions on the topic.
regarding the shared exchange with your agent: I found myself agreeing with both you and him 50%. I see no need for characters to grow or learn anything, as long as the story is interesting and the writing is good. the presence of a moral message itself has no bearing, for me, on the impact of a novel. I must confess to not having read your book, but if Adam and Cassie go down to the 50Shades room and nothing happens, it may even be more seductive and intriguing than if you had elaborated a debaucherous encounter, provided how it is written is interesting. it sounds like your agent is more of a plot focussed chap.
In a good novel the characters will learn and change. Otherwise what are you writing about?
A good novel reflects real life. Oftentimes in real life, growth and self realization do not occur
This made me think. I’m very much in the sex-positive camp, but I also believe literature loses something when any human experience gets flattened into a single moral message. Intimacy in fiction should be able to be liberating, destructive, confusing, sacred, restrained, or even refused. Sometimes the most powerful moment in a story is not the act itself, but the choice not to cross a line.
Do you have lived experience in sex work?
Imagine not publishing or understanding A Farewell to Arms by Ernest Hemingway because the fully consensual sex in the novel serves to underscore the characters' trauma and desperation.
My latest romance novels address this, though that's not what I set out to do. I set out to write a romance about twenty-somethings in the nineties, when sex positivity was in it's earlier stages, but dating still happened. I wanted to honor the nineties, Gen X, and life in the early stages of the hook up culture. Yes, they have consensual sex, and yes it is sexy, but...there are consequences. Broken hearts. Unwanted pregnancy. Discovering the value of chastity by confronting the very notion of sexual empowerment. The second book is about the couple in the now, with young adult children navigating the same issues. Honest talk about sex. Honest talk about chastity. Honest talk about love. Not a Hallmark romance, and not a queer/sex positive book. A normal romance with all the longing, mistakes, and redemption one finds in real life. They were a joy to write, and yes, I have to self-publish because even my publisher, who loved my cougar romance book, is looking for more queer stuff right now. Besides, it takes two years for them to publish a book once they accept it, and methinks we need to move faster than that now.
And here I am, writing about monks. Hmm.
What on earth would your agent make if the film Brief Encounter - when the point of the film is passion that is restrained?
Does he not realise that he has turned everyone into performing seals?
On the button…
How do you consider then that probably the single largest book (trilogy) sold in recent memory was about BDSM female sexual subordination, and it did not start through agents but was self-published then on-demand then bought? I’m speaking of course 50 Shades of Grey, and subsequent.
Fanfiction.net
The Writer’s Coffee Shop
Random House
I could hypothesize that the literary agents are looking for the next 50, not sex in particular.
It reminds me a lot of a book by Anne Cécile Desclos (aka Dominique Aury) under the pen name of Pauline Réage - “The Story of O”.
Likewise, I used to read a lot of Alberto Moravia, and his short story
“La donna che voleva essere comprata” (The Woman Who Wanted to Be Bought”) which is not quite what it sounds.
All these stories have in common the idea of a woman becoming alienated from herself and her body, to a degree.
“What happens when desire manifests as ownership”.
It’s a legitimate domain of writing, erotic writing lends itself to that.
It’s not for me. Desire manifests itself as partnership. But I understand how that works in other domains.
I have always considered 'The Story of O' a pretty pedestrian male fantasy.
This is, by far, the best line. “Today, in an industry that has mistaken simplicity for sophistication and ideology for art, we need not only a callback to morality but to literary depth. Because only literature that approaches all facets of the human experience from a nuanced perspective will ever be able to tell the truth about what it means to be human.” I couldn’t agree more. Thanks for your thoughts!